You Need to Spend More (And Better) On Google Ads. Here’s Why…

Listen Time: 43 Minutes

Have you ever wondered why Google Ads doesn’t seem to work for your business? 

Or do your ads work well, but you’re under pressure to reduce your spend (while still hitting your KPIs, of course)? 

Have you ever gotten the nagging feeling that AI really is here to replace your job as a marketer, and there’s nothing you can do about it?

If so, you’re not alone.

And, entrepreneur and Google Ads expert, Kasim Aslam, is ready to address those big questions bugging today’s entrepreneurs, marketers, and anyone else that has to budget out their ads and grow their brand.

In this episode of Smart Route, you’ll join a lively and frank discussion on big topics like ad budgeting, business strategy, and using AI and ChatGPT in your messaging.

Aslam explores: 

1. The reason Google Ads doesn’t work for some businesses (and what to do about it if you’re one of them). 

2. The surprising money strategies that help unsexy businesses build brands and earn deep customer loyalty (ever heard of Dollar Shave Club? Yeah, they’re one of them). 

3. Why you should stop worrying about AI stealing your job and, instead, invest more in more human messaging (bonus: you can also use AI to help you buy real estate). 

And more!

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About Kasim Aslam

Kasim is the founder and CEO of Solutions 8, one of the world’s top ranked Google Ads agencies. He was the first Traffic Coach for http://DigitalMarketer.com ’s ELITE coaching program, was hand-selected to create the new Paid Traffic Certification, is the co-host of Perpetual Traffic (ranked among the top 0.5% of all podcasts worldwide), Co-Founded The Driven Mastermind, the premier marketing mastermind globally, and Co-Authored “You vs Google”, which ranked #1 on Amazon bestseller’s list worldwide for both Advertising and Marketing (two of the most competitive non-fiction categories).

As an entrepreneur, Kasim has started four 7 & 8 figure businesses and has completed two successful exits.

Not only was Kasim  a recipient of the AZIMA’s 2017 TIM Award for Person of the Year, he was also named one of the Top 50 Digital Marketing Thought Leaders in the United States by The University of Missouri in 2020. His book, The 7 Critical Principles of Effective Digital Marketing, was featured as one of the Top 100 Digital Marketing Books of All Time by Book Authority.

Episode Transcript

Peter

Today we have our guest Kasim Aslam with Solutions 8. He’s here to talk to us about all things Google, AI, pricing, all that kind of stuff. Our co-host also is Brandon Jordan Brandon and I are sharing the responsibilities of bringing these podcasts to you and we thank you for joining us today.

Brandon Jordan

What’s up everybody, how are you doing?

Kasim

Thanks for having me guys. I’m excited.

Brandon Jordan

Awesome! Yeah, definitely happy to have you man. We had a chance again this you know we’ve connected before. I’m really excited to speak with you and I know we talked a little bit about the Ai so we definitely want to get some great feedback there.

Peter

pleased to have you here with us.

Brandon Jordan

You are a Google ads and analytics master right? So definitely very interested in picking your brain and and you know being able to have some really good conversation around those topics there. So I think ah a great way to really kick off things. Um, just tell us a little bit about yourself. Um, and your journey to becoming like a top Google ads thought leader like what was that like you know how’d you start? What was the process like and then how do you get where you are now.

Kasim

Started my business dude. It’s almost been twenty years that makes me feel so old. Yeah I started I was in 2006 so and so not quite 20 years but approaching that Mark you know like it’s a rounding error and I started building software.

Brandon Jordan

Wow 20 years

Kasim

That’s where the genesis was and um I built software just because there was money in it I had no passion for it at all I didn’t like it I wasn’t good at it. But I was a young man and I just thought like money money money money I’m gonna get money and I did for a little bit like you know it was um it was pretty easy.Epoch at the time. Ah I was building banking applications and I was actually building banking applications for the bank the brought down lehman brothers if you’ve ever seen the big short. Um, so that movie is about 1 specific bank that was based here out of arizona they never say the name of the bank.

But I was building software for that bank I was in the bank on Bank Failure Friday when the FDSC pulled in in their big black s Uvs and started picking down doors. Ah yeah, and so um, my whole world collapsed around me and and and the thing about Software Enterprise Software specifically that most people don’t know is generally speaking at least at the time.

Brandon Jordan

Um, yeah I remember that scene. Yeah.

Kasim

You’d get a very small nominal deposit like five percent upfront and then the remainder was paid over milestones generally on the back end and so you could have a 2 year build where you’re just not going to get paid until the latter half of ah of the development process. The development cycle and and and the bank. My biggest client.

Had just been captured. Let’s say and I’m at the absolute bottom of ah you know any level of receivership. So I just wasn’t going to get paid. So I I had to pivot and so software led to web sites and you know from going from software to web is like the cooked washing dishes.

Kasim

You know that’s how it felt for me at the time because I was I was Arrogant I was twenty when I started my business I was just like ah I can’t believe I’ve been relegated to this but dude I I was annihilated I lost everything My my house was closed on my car was repossessed I’d Dey Everybody’d worked for me and it was the best thing that ever happened to me entrepreneurly and if you’re listening to this and you’re an entrepreneur. Ah. Sadly, it would appear as though we are moving into a macroeconomic cycle that is going to be difficult to traverse and I’m here to tell you I’m the I’m the greybeard I’ve done this once before and I don’t know what happens how it happens but it does feel like a.

Axiom at this point like I don’t think we’re going to avoid some level of correction and it’s going to be hard and it’s going to be stressful and it’s going to be the most important. Best thing that’s ever happened to every entrepreneur, especially young entrepreneurs because making money when money is flowing is easy. You can do it by accident.

Making money when money begins to be efficient which is what happens in down markets. That’s a sign that you actually have something and learning to build a business in this environment means that you’re actually going to have a business that can grow and scale.

That’s what happened to me I was forced in a position to where I really needed to provide value leverage ah leverageable value. Um, and dude it was the best. It was the best thing that ever ever happened to me my entire life I learned the value of money I learned um you know most of what you think you own the bank actually owns um and that was this segue and so you know web became marketing marketing became paid ads and and I I was dragged along kicking and screaming too. It was my business partner that identified Google ads as being like the catalytic event for all of our clients. We were doing full funnel marketing and he’s the one that was like dude everybody who’s successful with us is successful in Google ads first.

And that makes a lot of sense because what I’m doing is I’m taking my client and I’m shooting them up I’m putting a sword in their hand I’m throwing them in the coliseum and I’m like can you survive you know and and Google is the ah it’s the great equalizer because somebody’s searching for what you sell and if it doesn’t sell. That’s what’s really funny about it man I love when people are like oh I’m going to go test Google ads no, you’re not. Google is going to test you like somebody goes to Google and says I want to buy this thing right now and then I put them in front of your thing and they didn’t buy it whose fault is that you know what I mean like I brought the horse to water the horse didn’t drink.

You’ve got poisoned what like it’ some wrong you know your offer is wrong. The articulation of the offer is wrong. The pricing is wrong. The terms are wrong. The product is where something’s wrong. So I love google for that reason I’m not going to tell you it’s the end. All the be all I don’t dude I run a Google ads agency I own one of the top Google ads agency in the world where I did until I sold it in October. Ah, and Google isn’t my number 1 lead acquisition tool. Yeah I appreciate that. Thank you? Um, Google’s not in my Google is not in my top 3 lead acquisition tools personally and you know we spend two hundred Grand a month and in Google but where it’s not the the best or the most important it’s the first.

Brandon Jordan

congratulations by the way. Yeah, absolutely.

Kasim

It’s where you can see oh in this commoditized ecosystem in this competitive environment where markets are Efficient. Can I compete and if the answer is no that doesn’t mean give up it just means Okay, you have a data point that lets you know here at the extreme bottom of the funnel. You’re never going to make ends meet so you have to go get Creative. 

Brandon Jordan

I think everybody needs that motivation right? Especially you know you talked about the possible correction that that we may have may have to deal with and.

Peter

You know it’s perfect.

Brandon Jordan

You know in checking your offer right? Anybody can make money when when revenue when when when the money’s flowing but you really test yourself test your offering when you know when that when that correction comes so now I appreciate it. It’s definitely. It’s definitely right on track. Um, speaking of the economy.

Kasim

Right.

Brandon Jordan

Right? You know everyone saying you know these days you know in this economy as a joke. Um you know, but you know the economy and our budgets are really top of mind. Um, is it for so many of us right? So as you know the cost of ads really keeps going up and then there’s more competition in just about every Industry. So Could you just kind of share some of it? Your own business Hacks for keeping ad costs low without sacrificing results in the economy or in this economy particularly yeah okay I will there you go? Yeah, what.

Kasim

Yeah, sure. Well so my response is going to be petulant Brandon I hope you’ll forgive me um, trying to keep ad costs low is trying to keep the price of stocks low. You can’t do it. You can’t do it like what you have to do is you have to build your business around what the prices end up being.

Ah, it’s an organic ecosystem if people are willing to pay this amount of money for this inventory. That’s what that inventory’s worth and so you know people come to me and say like oh the the inventory is too expensive or you know impressions are too expensive. Clicks are too expensive. No they’re not, they’re exactly as expensive as they should be based off of an organic ecosystem.

If we’re good capitalists if you and I have both read Adam Smith then we subscribe to this mark whether or not you like it as a whole other story but this is the philosophy. This is the ethos. This is the foundation upon which all of us have to live. It’s like saying it’s too hot outside what does that get you? What do we? What are we talking about here. You know I mean still if we gotta break bricks.

And it’s too hot outside. Well no, it’s not it’s how hot it is so now we find an umbrella. Do we move inside. Do we get air conditioning because you’re not going to block out the sun. The price of traffic is the price of traffic now we can have a whole discussion about traffic on the periphery and moving up the funnel and finding, you know, cheaper traffic. But that’s actually not. That’s a different topic of conversation.

Because that traffic is still what that traffic costs. You’re just making your trading time for money because if you go up higher in the funnel now you have to spend time dragging somebody down in the funnel if you go on the periphery now you have less traffic and it’s less available so traffic costs what traffic costs the key is number 1 knowing your numbers.

And I’ll give you a really good example. My business partner owns equity in a company that at present spends $30 to get a $30 client they spend $30 and they get a client that pays them $30 and you think to yourself dumbest business in the world but nay sir here’s what’s interesting.

Those clients from a lifetime value perspective are probably worth and and it’s a relatively new company but from a business model perspective. They’re probably worth about $1500 because it’s a consumable industry and they know their numbers so they know hey I can spend $30 in ads.

And somebody will pay me $30 and now what’s really interesting about that when you think about it is that’s a free client right spent 30 they paid 30 I’m actually like you just said break. Even so I can scale that business to the moon without running into cash flow issues and the lifetime value of the client is disproportionately large.

Brandon Jordan

Yeah, but it breaks big.

Kasim

Phenomenal business to be in. But so many small business owners who have their $30 product would be like oh I’d never spent $30 to get $30 I need to be profitable and where we get really really interesting is when you have the the and I’ve seen this ah frequently as markets get more sophisticated. You have businesses that will spend $500 to sell $30 knowing that the lifetime value on a long enough timeline is a thousand fifteen hundred twenty five hundred fifty thousand whatever it ends up being you see this in insurance. The amount of money you know people will come to me from. You know we have 200 clients across 150 some odd industries and so I see a lot of the same.

Ah, residents to realtors or clients will never take general dentistry clients will never take but but people selling life insurance. It’s such a travesty dude because the amount of money that life insurance salespeople make on one policy is 0 adjusted for margin of error. It’s absolutely nothing and what they don’t realize is the big insurance companies are willing to.

They’re willing to pay 10 times what they make on that policy because they know if I get your life insurance I’m going to get your home your auto your umbrella and so when you’re dealing in efficient markets like that. It’s not that the traffic is expensive. It’s that your model is inefficient. So what we need to do is we need to find a more efficient model. The market is telling you what a customer costs.

So now you have to find a model that allows you to serve that customer I Hope that wasn’t too too combative.

Peter

So it’s kind of looking at like repeat business or add ons to your existing product that you can offer to them.

Brandon Jordan

No, it wasn’t all.

Kasim

Dude, that’s exactly right and I mean when I look at I’m investing in businesses now and I’m trying to grow a portfolio of companies and I won one of my rules. Ah for myself is I won’t do anything that doesn’t have a recurring revenue component or a consumable component which is more or less recurring revenue is the opportunity to achieve recurring revenue.

Um, you know if you look at some of these like somebody comes to me and says I sell phone cell phone cases. You know you’re like well good luck like you sell something that costs $20 ah gross right? What’s your wholesale cost in shipping and assuming you’re you’re paying for that it costs twenty bucks you make five maybe and they buy from you once every 2 years if you’re lucky and why on earth would they really come back to you and we’re not even talking about the cost of traffic. So I love you know, high tickets great but even high ticket there’s there’s feast in fam with high ticket I love recurring I love consumable I love knowing that I’m not.

I’m paying for a customer one time that I’m going to have for a lifetime and I think those are the models that I’d really niche down into and invest in and and to be Frank They’re not inaccessible. You know you might think to yourself. Well I don’t have a recurring revenue model and my challenge to you is could you could you have.

You know a membership, a continuity offer you know I mean if you’re selling something big. Maybe there’s something on the back end of it if you’re selling pencils well. Mechanical pencils need a pencil lead and you might think to yourself well pencil led’s not a sexy business. That’s okay, Dollar Shave Club sold for $1,000,000,000 are razor heads sexy no.

Billion dollars because it’s a consumable and they knew and do I mean they’re selling those razors for a buck. You think they’re making their money on the frontend. Hell No absolutely not. But they had an efficient model and they knew on a long enough timeline. We’re going to be able to recoup costs. You have to be able to play that game from a cash flow perspective. But that’s why knowing your numbers is so critically important.

Peter

You know, being the average Joe Customer I buy into that because if if I go somewhere and have a good experience I’m gonna go back and I don’t care if it costs me a little bit more because it makes all the difference in the world I have the confidence to go back there and I know I’m going to get what I want and I know I’m going to go back again. As long as that.

Kasim

Oh dude people are so loyal.

Peter

Keep getting that same kind of return from them I totally get that.

Kasim

We’re the most brand loyal generation in the history of humanity. I have no data to support that. That’s my anecdotal observation. I just see it in people in customers in clients in my clients clients over and over and over and over again.

Um, we’re not, we’re not you know in the 5060 s and seventy s man that was a price shopping generation. Those are people that you could move with price and now everybody’s like it’s mission vision value. it’s a community it’s making sure. Yeah, like you know it’s its brand. Obviously.

The amount of money that people will spend for brand brand I mean Warren Buffett’s made all of his money on the on the backs of brand Warren Buffett invests in brand and he talks about it on an ongoing basis I mean Coca-cola 1 of his biggest holdings Apple 1 of his biggest those are companies that all of their value is in brand.

You know like you could never ever in 1000000000 years make the case that coke tastes billions of dollars better than the generic costco soda right? Obviously obviously maybe it’s like 10 percent better but it’s not ah, it’s a trillion dollar brain this damn thing.

Brandon Jordan

Um, yeah in anything? Yeah, um.

Kasim

And so yeah, we’re a brand loyal indoctrinated ah religiously committed ah multi-generational society and you can earn and keep that brand loyalty and and dude. What’s really funny is it’s not even hard. Do good business.

Do good business in the right way with good people like do the right thing and every now and again, it’s going to get a little like oh gosh we made a mistake. Let’s go make it right? but the brands and the companies that do that goodness does it pay dividends.

Peter

I’ve driven honda or  nothing. But for the last twenty five years I will always buy a Honda.

Brandon Jordan

Yeah Peter you are. You’re very brand loyal. We always talk about that. You love your hond is ah look at that.

Kasim

Dude I drive. I drive a forty year old Honda prelude, a 19 now you 7 Honda prelude. Hell yeah yeah, yeah, that was my 1 dumb purchase when I made my exit you know everybody else goes out and gets themselves like ah a lamborghini or whatever and I just wanted.

Peter

Um, really, that is a classic I Love that car.

Brandon Jordan

Harari yeah, that’s awesome.

Kasim

Was my car when I was a kid. So yeah I went and smack snacked up. But yeah.

Peter

That’s beautiful thing man well kind of talking along those lines. You know that $30 investment you know one of the things you know when it comes to like bidding strategies are there any things that you have in your tool belt that you use for bidding strategies.

Brandon Jordan

Google.

Kasim

What what? I’ll say is here’s the problem is if I tell you on this call right? another day. Um, you should be using for instance target cpa with no or tcpa ah 24 hours from now. It’s going to change. Um, you know if I tell you use manual with enhanced enabled the issue naval ravikant says something that I really loved. He goes I never give people advice on which stocks to purchase because then I have to be their best friend for the rest of their lives and talk to him twenty four seven 65 and tell him when to sell because if I tell you when to buy I have to tell you when to sell.

And so maybe what I’d like to do and I’m sorry you guys keep asking me questions that I don’t answer but I’ll offer a philosophy that I hope answers the question instead. Um the bid strategy is less important than your positioning.

As it pertains to your competitors who are using that bid strategy and here’s yeah I’m I’m going I’m going to be more specific and less annoying. We were the first agency really to spearhead performance max. That’s a fact where the first agency to make it work where the first agency to teach everybody how to use it and performance max off operates off of.

2 bitd strategies and and and they expand because of the settings but there’s really 2 right? It’s t row as tcpa. Um, here’s what’s really funny is in an e-com campaign you would assume because it’s e-commerce you’re going to use t row as the more people that were using t row as.

The harder that became we switched to tcpa and then we started teaching it and then people switched over to tcpa the more people that began using tcpa the more commoditized that got so then we switched to and then we abandoned performance max entirely and we switched over to standard shopping with manual bids. The the key isn’t finding the best bid strategy. The key is finding the bid strategy that nobody else is using because Google’s not on your side. My book is called you versus Google our mastermind is called you versus Google yeah, yeah, ah number 1 in advertising and marketing worldwide. No big deal. Um.

Peter

Right behind you.

Kasim

And I’m I’m only being mildly arrogant because I didn’t I didn’t really write that book. Yeah, ah you versus Google is based on the paradigm that all of Google’s recommendations are flawed because Google doesn’t want you to win Google doesn’t want you to make money they want to maximize the value of their inventory.

Brandon Jordan

And humble humble flets. Humble bles.

Kasim

Obviously it’s what I want to do I want to maximize the value of my inventory you want to maximize the value of your inventory Google is a company like any other company. So imagine an auctioneer for a moment. This is a fun thought exercise. It’s a fun way to think about Google you imagine an auctioneer and that auctioneer knows. Exactly how much money each person who is bidding on something is going to make off of it. They know everybody who’s willing to bid. They know exactly what those people are willing to pay um and they know historically speaking how. The competition is going to shift over time. You couldn’t trust that auctioneer right? that that’s price fixing by definition. There’s no trusting so the the key there is to not play the auctioneer’s game. So if you guys are all smart bidding on manual.

You all move manual like go smart. Um, so be really careful anytime you hear thought leaders are like oh no, we use this tactic? Well you know now you do and it’s going to work for 48 hours instead and I’m still in this for my buddy Jason fladlin Jason and I are business partners in the driven mastermind. Super super brilliant guy wrote a phenomenal book called one to many.

If you watched did y’all watch Alex for mosey’s book launch dude that that was the marketing super bowl that was the best thing that’s ever happened in the marketing world Jason helped Alex plan that like Alex paid Jason for consulting multi-day to sit down and go through it like Jason’s one of the smartest marketers in the world as evidenced by the fact that one of the.

The best marketers in the world hires him for consulting and Jason all the time will just denigrate the idea of like split testing for instance, um, Jason’s like look you know you split test red versus blue and red one great. Six months from now if I try blue blue will win and Jason’s real thesis seems to be and I’m distilling this. He hasn’t said this outright but I’ve been on enough calls with him. We. Do you know a call every Wednesday with our mastermind members? Ah, just go against the grain. Go against the crowd. That’s you know, good marketing sometimes is just standing out. It’s just Seth Godin’s purple cow. Everybody is facing north, you face south and and now all of a sudden I’m looking at this crowd whose face. Do I see right? I see 999000 back of the heads and then I see one face. So ah.

Bid Strategy bid caps messaging Funnels offers so much of it is just to be unique and stand out. Do something different. Don’t allow yourself to be commoditized and fall into the grooves.

Brandon Jordan

Okay, that’s that’s amazing advice. You know we ask these questions and not only are you answering them. But you’re just given all this motivation and you know so we definitely appreciate. It. Um, in the spirit of marketing and kind of kind of a pivot. Um, we did mention that we would kind of talk briefly about AI right? So I definitely wanted to kind of kind of yeah right, get that there skynet skynett right? Ah um so I just kind of wanted to pick your brain in terms of like what trends you’re seeing with AI um, especially when it comes to like.

Brandon Jordan

How it’s reshaping industries. Um, you know what we’re seeing, how we’re seeing a business, certain businesses adopt it and like what you’re seeing in the marketing field.

Kasim

Um, my my just to define terms. Let’s say and set the stage so we’re all operating from the same plane of thought my philosophical belief regarding Ai which I think is important to the discussion.

Brandon Jordan

Um, yeah I love it? Yeah, ah, that’s right.

Kasim

I’ve never been more optimistic about humanity ever ever. I’m a card carrying prepper. I’m sitting fifteen feet from a closet that has a year’s worth of food in it like I I believe in being prepared for who knows what? And if you look at Ai one of the most important economic factors during a full stop is energy. Right? I mean that’s why the petro dollar is basically supported just by oil and there’s a whole bunch of implications to that. But if you look at um, the generation and distribution of energy, if you look at supply chain issues, if you look at the fact that we’re about to have a population crisis and the distribution of resources based on that level of analysis.

Education communication Ai and and this is the other thing this isn’t a hyperbolic statement. That’s what’s so amazing about it Ai solves all of that in in probably 20 years

You know like give it give robotics time to catch up and and solves every problem we have in 50 years but it solves these massive and and as far as humanity’s concerned these are lifelong problems. These are problems that humanities had since the beginning of humanity and Ai can will and does it like there’s evidence of this.

Solve these problems and so here’s why I say that here’s why I preface with that which I know is annoying Um, approach ai with optimism ah because I think that ai can only make things better. Um, the key there. Those is a tool. It’s not autonomous yet.

I mean maybe it will be I don’t know I don’t know enough if about it. Ah, and it’s a tool that we have been using for publicly for like 5 years Google searches ai driven so this whole like I mean chat Gpt came out and everybody saw an interface from like oh my god a I just launched no didn’t you’ve been using Ai.

The last decade anytime you engage with Google that’s Ai anytime you engage I mean Google ads has been Ai driven. Ah Facebook the the algorithmic display of content based off of your utilization demographic psychographic profiling factors that’s Ai.

We’ve had Ai. We’ve been using Ai we’ve been exposed to Ai. We’ve been profiled by Ai, we’ve been engaging with Ai we’ve been talking to Ai like Ai has been a thing somebody just gave you a little window that led you to talk to it and all of us flipped our shit so Ai is not new.

Brandon Jordan

Yeah, now everyone’s everyone’s losing it now.

Kasim

Yeah I do think ai is going to cost a ton of jobs I mean ah OpenAI the company that owns Chat GPT did the largest study of universal basic income ever conducted. There’s a reason for that you take some of the smartest people in in Silicon Valley with the most money and the most visibility is to what’s going to happen and what do they choose to waste their time on a study on Universal basic income like that.

Obviously there they’re like okay guys hey we’re gonna We’re gonna cause a ripple and we’re gonna want to be able to solve it. But I don’t think it’s. I don’t think it’s blood in the streets Catastrophic error I think it’s paradigm shift and for marketers specifically I’d be really careful about resting on your laurels. Um, what I’m hearing and saying I just did ah ah a.

Brandon Jordan

That’s great and.

Kasim

Perpetual traffic podcast interview with Ryan Dice who’s one of the smartest marketers alive right? like obviously and I think that goes without saying at this point like he’s just achieved that sort of legend status and the thing that Ryan said that resonated so deeply with me was if you look at the core facets of marketing.

The most important facet of marketing is messaging period Full stop like fulfillments commoditized systemizable automated um funnels traffic Even I’m a traffic guy ah media management buying bidding.

It’s messaging messaging is the thing that’s the most important and b the most human here’s what’s really funny people are the first thing they’re trying to abdicate to Ai is messaging very for now part of that is a byproduct.

The fact that the tool that was given to us was a messaging tool had we been given a governance tool first or you know a creative like mid-journey first maybe the conversation would be a little bit different but regardless of the why they’re trying to abdicate messaging. What’s interesting about that is while the ai tool can accomplish tasks better than a human can.

It’s trained on the aggregate average and if you go I just did this I was invited to speak in an event. They asked me for a title and I went to chat gp and I asked it to give me a title based on my parameters and then I had to spend 20 minutes workshopping the title now. What I finally landed on I thought was phenomenal.

But chat Gpt didn’t give me a phenomenal output I had to. I had to use it as a tool in order to get yeah exactly I had to tweak it so it was a great resource. But if I’d relied on it for creativity. The guidance that you know, really understanding. What do people want to hear? What should my message be about what is the key.

Brandon Jordan

Yeah, the tweaking that’s right? yeah.

Kasim

Takeaways in the points. What are they gonna walk away knowing um it would have been garbage. It would have been distilled garbage and what’s funny is everybody right now seems to be heading in that direction. They’re not hiring content writers. They’re firing them like oh we’ll just use chat Gp is no big deal write your book with chat gbt right? Your blog’s at chat Gb and what’s funny about that is.

It’s not going to make content creation easier. It’s going to make it more important. It’s going to make good content writers more potent. You know that title I came up with I did int 20 minutes of chat tbt probably could have took taken me a couple hours you know just to sit there and think but I had so ah this this fun little a I bought to think with. So.

If you look at Ai as a powerful tool that can assist your employees and your staff like I think you’re, you’re walking into an enabled future if you look at it as a full scale replacement. We might get there but we’re not there yet.

Brandon Jordan

Yeah, did.

Kasim

Sure not there yet and you’re going to get hurt. Go ahead.

Peter

Trump question for you. Pardon me, um, come up you know talking about the Ai piece and your use of it. One of the videos that you posted on Youtube you talked about using AI to put perhaps it was a contract you’re looking at some real estate I believe in North Dakota

Kasim

Yep I buy all my houses in fargo. That’s to prepare Peter. I got 20 doors in fargo because if you could look it up. Fargo North Dakota is the number one most recession recession resilient piece of of of land. Let’s say Recession resilient City in the Continental United States So sorry, keep going.

Peter

Yeah, so you using that tool then how much time do you I mean I’m guessing it saved you tons of time trying to review the document you dump that into what was it my ask a i.com

Kasim

Yeah, some like that forgot I even forgot the Url now. It’s funny you you know it better than I do but for anybody listening there’s a real estate contract that was way too long and there’s this really phenomenal ai tool that actually my v a found me online that um.

It will. It will scan basically any pdf document and then and then synthesize it for you to synergize it. Let’s say and then and then it gave me the bullet points.

Peter

Right? That was really cool. I was really impressed when I was kind of going through doing a little bit of my homework. First of all I know Fargo pretty well. My mom’s from North Dakota and so that kind of captured my attention so I was kind of curious to follow up on that as well I think that’s awesome.

Kasim

Oh cool, yeah nude I love fargo I love the I love the whole the midwest I think that’s you know that’s still the heartland as far as I’m concerned but yummy think about that example, that Ai it didn’t tell me once it gave me the highlights of the contract like.

Brandon Jordan

Yeah, Midwest is a great great place. Yeah.

Kasim

Are these terms good. Are they bad? What should these bullet points. Do I negotiate on which of them do I not which you know where where’s the the pitfalls. What am I worried about how does this max up against the rest of my portfolio et etc cetera cetera e cetera so the Ai didn’t do the real estate transaction for me right? I’m buying a small apartment building. There’s.

I need to know is somebody buying multifamily units I need to know multifamily I need to know syndication I need to note terms I need no interest rates like there’s all this stuff that I still need to know and anybody who wanted to just rest that contract at the feet of Ai you they’re gonna get screwed if they try to do that. So great. Great! Great tool.

But it’s a tool and a resource. It’s a tool on your tool belt. It’s not like a replacement for a full scale entity or person or thought.

Peter

Right? right? I think a lot of people are going down that path thinking that exact same thing as I will Ai’s gonna take care. He’s gonna get rid of everything I’m gonna be out of a job. My family’s gonna be out of a job me to be out of my house.

Brandon Jordan

Um, yeah I Love that answer like that’s right, That’s right? So you get yeah.

Kasim

I see it every day. Yeah I do I see to my clients. My clients are like letting good people go um, thinking like oh we’ll just use Ai and in some ways it’s working you know like we’ve got a client that I’ll try to veil their identities so they don’t hear this and get pissy at me. But um, they have a.

Significant number of products and they had a graphic design team that was taking those products and then putting them in specific contexts because it’s really helpful for especially for display advertising to be to see your product in use and the. They didn’t need the design team because they were able to figure out how to do that with various tools I don’t think mid-journey did it as well. I forget which one they’re using but 1 of those visual visualization tools. They basically automated the entire process and you look at it and you’re like yeah that actually that really kind of works. But what we’re running into now is all of a sudden for the first time in a year and a half they’re getting compliance issues and they’re getting compliance issues because Google doesn’t like showing body parts even like a full thigh even ah, you know like there’s a lot of just triggers that a person can be taught knows and the Ai can be taught over time. but but again that’s where we get into that hey there was there was a middle ground here and you missed it.

Maybe having half the team to you know monitor review and approve these images and teach the Ai how to how to improve upon them instead of like yeah wholesale acts the world and then you just got 1 poor guy there that there’s too many images for him to look over.

Brandon Jordan

Instead of letting everybody go? Yeah yeah, yeah, ah yeah, it sounds like it sounds like there is um, still obviously a need for that human interaction like so.

There’s not. There’s not gonna be blood blood in the streets just like you mentioned right? Everyone can relax. You know that there’s got to be some sort of happy medium where we can still use this powerful tool. It’s not gonna replace everyone’s jobs right? that that’s kind of the the mindset you’re in.

Kasim

I think that there will be I think that there will be significant shifts in where labor is required. You know I mean the the obvious and easy example is uber and lyft uber and lyft are together the largest employers in the United States outside of the us government if there are a lot to be considered employers which is something they’re fighting really hard. Um.

Autonomous vehicles are now are now and they don’t need to sleep. They don’t need and they don’t make mistakes you know what? if forty fifty Thousand people a year die in car accidents if we had 100% autonomous vehicles that number would probably drop to like 7 right adjusted like there’d be there’d be some anomalies. But.

Um, you’d save lives you’d save money 99% of cars are are at stasis at any given time you’re only using your car for like about an hour a day even if you’re a heavy commuter. So I think autonomous vehicles are the only thing stopping them is legislation. Ah, the only thing I mean they’re they’re already technologically capable.

They’re already more efficient, an autonomous vehicle even though it’s a little bit more expensive is less expensive than a normal vehicle and a driver and insurance and liability and they’re more fuel efficientcient Obviously um and if you could pull people together from a resource management perspective Imagine a vehicle that was separated into pods.

It’s like dude these 4 people are going generally in that direction on a daily basis because they have the same commute paths instead of 4 different vehicles I just put you into one but with enough separation that it’s you know it’s comfortable because we don’t like being close to the humans for whatever reason. So if that takes place and I can’t see a future where it doesn’t every uber and lyft driver is out of a job.

So we’re truck drivers taxi kept drivers school, bus, drivers, etc, Etc, etc. Now I don’t want to say that that’s not a problem because it is and from an industry specific perspective. It’s just like manufacturing leaving the United States when it did um, it’s it’s like any other shift. Ah.

I don’t think we’re looking at a John Steinbeck novel where there’s you know, roving bands of graphic designers crawling the streets begging for you know, will work for a sandwich but I do think that people should pay very close attention to where labor markets move. Um and and and don’t get romantic about how they make their money.

The the counter argument to the uber and lyft discussion is the fact that I can’t walk into any retail strip and not see now hiring signs at like twenty five bucks an hour. It’s unbeliev my freaking grocery store. Dude it’s like my grocery store is hiring bagggers.

Twenty Five bucks an hour or stockerss and there’s a bunch of things till robotics catch up. There’s a bunch of things that like you know that’s more or less analogous to an uber and lyft job. Um, hopefully that doesn’t sound dismissive so I won’t say that there aren’t going to be disruptions I think there are going to be disruptions. But I think ai is going to help more than hurt.

And the people that it hurts sadly and we don’t have to have this discussion if you don’t want to but it’s going to be emerging nations. You know like that’s always always where most of the the pressure is felt is at the bottom.

And so if we need to mitigate risk and help anybody those those are the people that we should think about helping.

Peter

We were talking about the autonomous vehicles I’ve been somewhat apprehensive about that just because in the early days. It didn’t seem like it was like really quite there but my wife made a very good point to me she goes I look forward to that day.

Look at at the other people on the on the road look at all the distracted drivers look at the people all looking at their phones are driving down the road and that’s when I did a complete one eighty. It’s like you are spot on correct I Love driving I Love getting behind the little car and driving. It’s the other people on the road that I worry about now.

Kasim

I was terrifying? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, well most people you know they say that looking at your phone is worse than driving drunk because at least if you’re driving drunk you’re paying attention.

Peter

Oh yeah, there because you’re trying really hard to stay straight. Um.

Kasim

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that’s exactly right? So I’m looking forward to autonomous vehicles too and you know that’s a fun. That’s a fun lead domino to think about because I forgot what the data point is it’s something like even at the heaviest traffic only 30% of the surface is covered.

Which means and that’s just because we have to keep such a separation if it’s a computer driving that separation isn’t necessary and so now traffic becomes more efficient. Um, which means timelines become more efficient. You don’t need massive parking garages homes don’t need garages you don’t need all this huge driveway You don’t need you know roads that are quite the same size like there’s all these things that we don’t need.

And so like just just the garages just to use that 1 example, what do we do with our garages you’ve got every single family home in the continent of the United States has a Two- Corps garage now we have this excess real estate like that’s a fun business opportunity to think of so now you’re not an uber in lyft driver anymore. But what if you started ah a business where you convert garages demand caves hell yeah.

You know, like now we’re cooking this is fun like that sounds like a blat right? and and and people don’t need the garage because they don’t need the cars. So like there’s just a ton of it’s every shift you know it’s just like it’s just like it’s displacement. It’s it’s ah it’s a law of physics. It’s going to push things in other ways and we’re going to have. We’re going to have opportunity but you have to be receptive and open to it and that is the thing that scares me when I look at the labor market here and I’m about to say a bunch of things that are going to get me canceled when I look at the labor market here and I and I compare it to the labor market I internationally because I hire internationally a lot I have 100 employees in in 80% of them are outside of.

Ah, the United States um the international labor market is more accessible amenable agreeable a bunch of other $12 words as it relates to being.

Proactive nimble flexible creative like there’s I do it I’ve never heard an international employee tell me that’s not my job but the number of time man I love this country. You know my family goes all the way back to the sixteen hundreds related to Thomas Jefferson he wrote the fricking constitution I’m I’m a I’m a red white and blue fan.

But that means that I get to hold it to a standard and the number of times I’ve heard a red white and blue telling me oh that’s not my job that’s not my job description. You know or like or just you know write at 5 clock out. Can’t even get them on slack. Um.

They’re going to have a tough time competing in that space. So I think that we need to be a little bit more receptive to the idea that hey you just became really replaceable in certain industries. Let’s start maybe paying attention to where the margin of improvement is yeah.

Brandon Jordan

And certain industries for sure. Yeah, okay, no that’s no, that’s definitely something to think about. Um you know that again, you know, just start to finish really all of your advice and.

All of your feedback whether we’re talking about Google ads and different strategies and all the way through Ai right? just different perspectives that you want to have and you know there. There’s all these different thought processes. Especially when it comes to ai but you know, definitely great feedback and we appreciate it for sure. Yep.

Kasim

You feel free to edit around that too because I’m sure I said a bunch of things they’re like politically charged you’re like call tracking Matchs does not endorse this message.

Peter

Like what they wait to be respectful of everybody’s time right now we kind of lead into the exit here. So on that point, right? on 1 final note are there any tips or tricks that you want the audience trying out heading into 2024 anything advertisers should be aware of. Focusing on.

Kasim

I Think that the the new emphasis should be growing community. It used to be like I just give me a customer and I’ll take that customer and they’ll give me money and then I’ll move on and I’ll give me another customer and that assembly line model. It’s so inadequate.

And it puts you at this massive disadvantage instead of a customer thinking. Um as a new member of your community and I don’t care what you sell you’re like I sell loose-leaf tea. Great. This person’s interested in loose leaf tea. You know a lot about them now that’s a lot to know about a human right? There’s a lot that you can infer there.

And so how is it that you can draw them into your community love on them treat them like make them feel like they’re actually home and you can do that. Whatever you can do that with Saas you can do. That’s what you’re doing on this podcast a podcast is a community you’re building a community so businesses need to think about themselves as community because with a community.

When somebody’s a community member when you have a member base that’s a well from which you can draw on a frequent basis when you just have a customer. There’s not a lot of equity in that relationship. Um, and I’m a paid traffic guy telling you that I don’t think paid traffic is the way of the future I think it’s a tool.

But the real emphasis should be on community building which means really giving first communities relationships relationships are built on systems of reciprocity where you give first give first give more give last and that’s easy to do and do it on podcasts Youtube channels social profiles. Um. You know obviously memberships but build a community for yourself and for your business and and I think you’ll see very quickly that it pays dividends.

Brandon Jordan

yeah, that’s beautiful man. Yeah yeah, right.

Peter

Nice and you know that that community we could also apply tour in places that we live we need to rebuild some of our communities. You know that that that touch with people.

Kasim

Oh dude. Yeah I think it’s the tragedy of the Western civilization is that we’ve technologized ourselves. I just invented that word tech technologylogized there we go technologized ourselves out of the need for human interaction.

Peter

The works.

Kasim

For community like community was such a necessity for so long just for survival and the minute it became the minute it we were in a position where we didn’t need community to survive. We abandoned it and now I think that’s the one like dude that’s the hole in everybody’s hearts I’m in 4 masterminds. I own one of them like why? Why would anybody do that.

It’s because you’re starving. You’re dying for community. We’re all dying for community and in a lot of businesses. Some are more set up for that than others but every business in some way can feed that ethos.

Brandon Jordan

Yeah, well said man. So I think you for all the listeners. Everyone listening to you guys heard it community right? You know, just like you say give first, give early, give often right? That’s definitely a great message. You know whether you’re a marketer just like you mentioned a saas company and again, that’s you know. Ah, big reason why we do this podcast right is to build that relationship share knowledge you know and and really continue to build our community so kasan this has been awesome. Man, is there anything that speaking of community right? that you want to plug when it comes to your community. Whether it’s your podcast you know and any type of services that you’re offering.

Peter

You know? yeah again.

Brandon Jordan

Anything that you want to plug before we get out of here.

Kasim

Yeah, if you want Google ads help go look up solutions. A I think we’re the best Google ads agency in the world I don’t own it any longer. But I know like and trust the guys that bought it I’m still the Ceo of the company I’m still a fan I’m I’m the co-host of perpetual traffic. Ah I’m the co-owner of driven mastermind. We’ve got a great Youtube channel at solutions 8

Um, where we shoot a video every day So it’s pretty hard not to find me or engage with me on some level assuming that you’d want to do that for whatever reason. Yeah, that’s my little wife’s book. She is a brilliant brilliant human who wrote a book called on Postpartum depression.

Um, and and interestingly she’s about to potentially launch a community for expectant moms to give them a place to go and then be also maybe a sense as to what what to expect because we still do a really bad job at that which is funny considering that pregnancy might be the.

Brandon Jordan

There’s a community again.

Kasim

The thing that humans have done the longest. Um, there’s still not. You know there’s still not as much support as there could be so I appreciate you bringing that up Peter. Thank you.

Peter

My pleasure and I think on that note I think we’re good.

Brandon Jordan

Awesome Well thank you costs minutes. Yeah, it’s been a pleasure. Yeah man, thank you so much. We appreciate you blessing us with the wisdom and knowledge here and Sharon and taking the time to chat with us today. Definitely look forward to chatting again and. For the listeners. Thanks for tuning into the smart road podcast and hope you guys have a great day. Thanks, take care. 

Peter

See you? awesome.